Hey, no offense was intended towards your blog. I'm sure you do take it seriously and have respect in your field. I wasn't trying to make it seem like your blog was worthless, just that it's a blog. Not really the kind of thing we use to back ourselves up in debate.

My point was, and still is, that Biden attending college and the fact that he didn't serve in Vietnam were not necessarily causual.

And, trust me, the fact-checking issue of certain members has been a long running issue long before this post.

Thanks for checking in, small world.

Hey dont be so hard on yourself just take a deep breath keep trying you will get better...

__________________
Countdown until Obama leaves office



The Next POTUS

That being said, I do have to speak out in defense of one of our own.

The wording in your blog, Pruitt, was ambiguous.

By stating that Biden went to school and became a trial lawyer "rather" than serving in Vietnam, the sentence reads as if the two were mutually exclusive.

Rather than mow my lawn, I sat on the couch and had a beer.

I don't really fault Froggy in this case for interpreting that line the way he did. I don't know if it was your intention to imply that he dodged his service or not, but that's how it reads to me as well. If it had said "Unable to serve in Vietnam..." that would have been a different story.

Frog, I don't understand where you're coming from.

You don't trust reputable newspapers, because they could be lying.

You don't trust the people that the newspapers get their information from, because they could be lying.

You don't trust people who give you first hand accounts of events as they happened.

You don't trust the word of people that events directly happened to.

Man, it must be a scary world that you live in. If you want Joe Biden himself to come to your door and hand you a copy of his lung scan and show you a spent inhaler from the 1960s and give you an original, notarized copy of his medical deferment you're delusional.

You can believe the Washington Post, you can believe the information Biden supplied, you can believe Joe Walther's first hand account, or you can line your windows with tin foil and continue to think that everyone is lying about everything.

No its not a scary world I just dont take things at face value.

Biden lost all creditability during his primary run of 88 .

Newspapers go by the motto

If it bleeds it leads they are there to make money and will twist the information to there liking.

Oh, for the love of God.

This is absolutely pointless.

*ding*
*ding*

WINNAR!!!

Yes, Frogman, they did. I don't think--at least from your responses here--that you have any idea how it worked. I don't think you were around in 1960 or '61.

Joe and I were but we were busy registering for that draft. Joe is five months and two days younger than I am. I had already registered. I SAW him register with Selective Service.

Here's the way it worked. EVERY male upon turning 18 years of age--but not females--had to register for the draft through Selective Service.

Those who failed to do so were the draft dodgers, not the ones who registered. Joe REGISTERED.

However, draft boards had the autonomy and discretionary power to REJECT any male they deemed unsuitable as long as there was verifiable data to support the rejection.

They rejected Joe for medical reasons. The draft board had verification for information required on the registration form.

FACT, Frogman, Joe did NOT apply for a college deferment. Had the draft board not rejected him, he might have done so. He simply went on to college, and then to law school.

College deferments were legitimate--not to mention LEGAL--reasons to avoid the draft. Applying for and receiving one does not imply cowardice on the part of the requester.

I don't think Dick Chaney was a coward because he applied for and received five deferments from the draft. I don't like the way Dick Chaney conducts the business of government, but I assure you that he's light years from being a coward.

You, on the other hand, seem to use sweeping generalizations to draw inferentially prejudiced conclusions to suit yourself. Keep on doing this if you wish. However, it only diminishes your own credibility and makes you look silly.

I've been with Joe Biden through some of the most trying personal tragedies imaginable. And, your beliefs notwithstanding, Joe Biden is NO coward.

He reported his condition on the registration form as REQUIRED BY LAW and UNDER THREAT OF POTENTIAL PERJURY CHARGES. The draft board verified the condition through BOARD CERTIFIED physicians.

He didn't have to prove his condition. He was not qualified to prove his condition. The doctors WERE qualified to do so and they did so.

Your contempt for Joe Biden, specifically, and Liberals in general, seems readily apparent. When facts point out your prejudices for all to see, you resort to even more irrelevant straw man logic.

This was true in areas like Bosnia where you served. There was no defined combat zone there and troops, wherever they were, had to be careful and always travel in tandem with other troops.

It was not true in Vietnam. Al Gore was safely ensconced well behind the demilitarized zone--mostly in Saigon. Combat troops considered Saigon as an "R & R" break from the jungle warfare.

With minimal use of common sense, about the only things we had to worry about while in Saigon was catching a killer strain of VD or getting killed in some back alley by a Vietcong prostitute sympathizer.

Al Gore was a nothing back then. His father, on the other hand, was well-known and unbelievably influential. I don't think Al had a direct hand in it, but dad's influence resulted in his assignment to a journalist unit.

I have no idea if you've ever backed a draft dodger. Your accusation relative to Joe Biden being one, on the other hand, seems to indicate that you have no idea what constitutes a draft dodger, though.

The evidence supporting Biden's selective service registration is a matter of record--some of which is NOT public. You don't recognize it because you don't want to recognize it.

If you think Joe Biden is unsuitable to serve as Vice-President of the United States, don't vote for him. However, your continued charges of "draft dodging" are baseless.

Joe Biden does not have to prove a thing to YOU relative to his registration for selective service. You were yet to be born when he registered for the draft.

As for my statement relative Republican information... again, you invoke your selective recall. I wrote that I have information obtained through a freedom of information act request concerning servers and non-servers of BOTH parties.

I will post that list, which came straight from the archives of the United States Government, as soon as I find it amidst a ton of paper reports.

I used to enjoy reading your posts. Lately, though, you seem to have raised the art of drawing inferences to suit your personal prejudices and biases to a new level.

Regards,

Joe Walther

__________________
Joe Walther
http://thetruefacts.blogharbor.com

*stands*
*applauds*

I'm no fan of Joe Biden, but that, right there? That was fucking brilliant.

This just isn't even fair.

Joe I am still having issues with this "deferment"

WILMINGTON, Del. - August 27, 2008 - (WPVI) -- People across the country were anticipating the speech by Senator Joe Biden of Delaware Wednesday, ahead of his speech at the Democratic National Convention.
Among them, the Delaware natives who worked with, taught, and befriended the Biden family.
His yearbook is on display at Archmere Academy in Claymont, where Biden played sports and was president of his class at the private catholic school.


http://abclocal.go.com/wpvi/story?section=news/politics&id=6355360


If he was so bad with asthma how did he play sports ?


I dont know this article might be fabricated I am not sure



I think this issue will get plenty of air time over the next two months.


I dont dislike all Liberals just the ones that run for public office

Does this thread have an exit strategy?

We're posting here so we don't have to post there.

We're spreading opinions.

We're fighting a war on facts.

God Bless... at first I was sorry I missed this thread, but having read it, I'm glad I wasn't around.

Okay, Encyclopedia Brown Boy Detective.

Maybe you should pose your questions on athletes with asthma to Jackie Joyner-Kersee, Amy Van Dayken, and others with asthma who have won Olympic medals despite their condition.

Having asthma does not mean you can't play sports.

In this case the medical board conducting Biden's physical made the call, not him.

Drop it.

Let us know when you find it.

It might be hidden next to the WMD.

You bet there is! As soon as I can find my leather flight jacket, a fighter-jet, a pilot to fly it, and an aircraft carrier to land on, I'm going to declare, "Mission accomplished!"

Then, I'm going to develop a whole new "strategery" for finding stuff out!

Regards,

Joe Walther

1. truthiness (noun)
1 : "truth that comes from the gut, not books" (Stephen Colbert, Comedy Central's "The Colbert Report," October 2005)
2 : "the quality of preferring concepts or facts one wishes to be true, rather than concepts or facts known to be true" (American Dialect Society, January 2006)

Joe

It is great that you will defend your friend I think I would do the same.

You proved my point with

"I've been with Joe Biden through some of the most trying personal tragedies imaginable. And, your beliefs notwithstanding, Joe Biden is NO coward."


I never said Joe Biden was a coward but you as a very respected member here said I did and it becomes gospel . I did state that he plagirized a speech in the 88 primaries but that was brushed aside since Joe himself came out and said it and it can't be defended by anyone.

That is a big problem in this country the press distorts what is said to there liking and the mindless drones take it as fact without checking for themselves.

People in this country believe too much what they read and dont think for themselves (How else do you explain 28 years of a Bush or Clinton in the White House??)

We have become a country of "Bandwagon Jumpers" we go with what the masses do and dont make the effort to become informed voters.

Come this November a new POTUS will be elected it is no secret I dont like the Obama/Biden ticket (didnt like Obama before he picked Biden) I will be a proud American if Obama is elected to show how far as a country we have come I wont be a happy American for the 4 years he is in office.

First of all, let me clarify something. Do you see how it might damage your credibility whenever you go off on one of your rant-filled accusations based on nothing more than visceral reaction?

It could not possibly be the WAY you react to things you dislike, so it has to be the community's fault because they take what I say as gospel out of their respect for me.

This is complete nonsense. It's also a colossal insult to every regular poster who reads and responds on this forum when you imply such rubbish. But, you know what? I honestly don't think you see it.

Frogman, you called Joe Biden a draft dodger and I called you on it. I'm not going to split hairs over your specific words. You did it in such a way as to make it reasonable for readers to infer your intent. It's as simple as that.

I'm a poster on this forum, nothing more... nothing less. I post from a fact base in matters of which I have some expertise. I make sure to differentiate between premises that I can back up with material fact, and those that are pure speculation on my part.

Joe Biden didn't serve in the military and he went to college. These are verifiable facts, Frogman. YOU conclude from these verifiable facts that he's a draft dodger. See the difference?

You had absolutely nothing to support your claim. You still don't. So, as you always do on this forum, you sidetrack the original issue with irrelevant drivel, being very careful NOT to mention your original premise.

I did not raise any issues or call you in any way relative to the plagiarism comment because it was a fact. Others may have pushed it aside, but I didn't. Not only did he do it, he openly owned up to it.

It had nothing to do with my calling you out on the draft dodger claim. It still does not. If you have problems with others who challenged you on the matter, take it up with them.

I deleted the rest of this in the interests of space AND because I have no argument with it. However, none of it has any relevancy to your original charge of Biden as a draft dodger.

If you are going to state YOUR inferential conclusions as fact, you had better be prepared to back them up, especially when it involves someone I know and have known for more years than you've lived so far.

This matter, at least relative to my participation in it, is at an end. As I told you earlier, believe whatever you wish to believe. But don't go leveling accusations that you can't support with material fact.

This one had to do with a public figure. I'd call you on it just the same if it involved any of the regulars on this forum.

I deeply respect the regulars who post here. It's a great forum and one that is well run.

Regards,

Joe Walther

Joe I think you are just too close to this situation and can not make a impartial view on this subject.

The plagirism is the root of this whole debate. It goes to the character of the person in question if he lied in 88 why couldnt he get a doctor to sign off on a "medical deferment" ?

Yes it did happen during the Draft for Vietnam.

In some countries it is often possible to evade military service by bribing corrupt draft officers, or by finding a doctor who will certify one as medically unfit. Moving out of the country.

Source : NationMaster - Encyclopedia: Draft dodger

Its not the Washington Post but I hope it will suffice

Who was trying to knock up his girlfriend or joking about killing his abusive old man to claim "sole support." Who was lamming to Canada, faking insanity or homosexuality, or paying off a quack doctor for a medical deferment.
Let's teach some N.Y.C. harmony